Durrrr 4 bet with 8-6

[Pocket Eights]

On high stakes poker ep 9, Tom Dwan 4 bet Howard Lederer with 8-6 offsuit.

This play makes no sense, Howard for the whole intire time he never got out of line except for showing the KJ but that was a different story.

When he's now on tv, i don't know what it is but he re raised Phil Laak with K7 suited in the Aussie Millions cash game and Laak has the reputation of chainsawing it.

Is this just his fame or does this make no sense.

[DennisG90]

o.k., heres how I see it:

At this moment, Dwan is surely of the opinion that he can outplay Lederer in position, who is only playing solid hands and barely ever bluffing.

However, Dwan doesnt put him on aces or kings there, or put in other words, Dwan is still to find out. He might also think that he could get Lederer off of kings perhaps and so he must only fear aces which are unlikely to be held (Lederer would never flat call Aces preflop and prolly not kings either).

So Dwan wants to be the preflop aggressor, as he thinks that he can take away the pot on latter streets way more easily by reraising preflop. On the flop, Dwan would use any scare card to take a shot at the pot, so if an ace had hit, im sure he wouldve bet to try to get Lederer off of jacks or queens or kings. However, Lederer makes it pretty easy for Dwan as hes not willing to bluff at all, but plays ABC poker by checking to Dwan 3 times.

Im sure that had Lederer bet on any street, Dwan would have come over the top. Dwan is surely not playing this hand the way he did to give it up if he doesnt hit. So he wouldnt have checked it down, if the 6 handnt hit, but by checking 3 times, Lederer has shown that he is very likely to have ace king and that any pair is good in that spot. So Dwan checked for value.

Another positive effect for Dwan is that he had to show is hand down. Everyone realised that Dwan is capable of such a sick play. However, Dwan might play aces or kings the very exact same way next time and get paid off by a weaker hand.

BTW, heres another example of Dwan´s sick play, happened yesterday:

http://www.highstakesdb.com/view-han...?GameID=316554

From this hand you can see that this kind of play is bound to go wrong some time given that your opponent has aces/kings or flops a set or just shoves very light.

PS: Hope my text makes any sense, am pretty tired atm

[drewlovesomaha]

Durrr is a great NLHE online player - other than that I think he is headed for a hard fall. Most of his "great plays" are against people not truly familiar with his over aggressiveness - Howard, Eastgate, even Barry admitted at the time he wasn't as familiar with durrr's style as he should have been. Against players familiar with him -i.e. Gus, Ivey, Patrik - durrr is spewing money like he has Warren Buffett's bankroll, which he clearly doesn't. For those unfamiliar, durrr is down 3 million this year online, and actually 4 million down in PLO - included in that minus 3 million, he is down 488k to Patrik in the challenge which would result in a 1.5 million payout.
My point is that in alot of the cases where some would say durrr outplayed an opponent a plausible case can be made that his opponent severely misplayed his hand. As far as the hand with Howard, he(Howard) has to decide preflop to either go all in or fold to durrr's 4 bet. I have never really seen Howard misplay a hand that badly, and I was quite surprised when he only called. The only case to made for calling once he was that involved was if he was shoving regardless of what flopped, having also put durrr on AK. None of the plays durrr made during HSP would have worked on Gus, Daniel, Phil, Patrik, Doyle or virtually anyone who took the time to become familiar with durrr's game. The only thing he really has going for him is that the entire world is set up to pay him off when he does actually have the goods.

[The 6th Wilbury]

Not to pimp a non-PR podcast (even though Seebs is okay with it), but Aaron Jones of Leggo Poker does a nice, detailed analysis of this hand on Monday's 2+2 Pokercast. I listened to the segment a couple of times just to soak it all in.

There's a great line in an episode of The West Wing, in which Josh Lyman says, "There comes a day in every man's life -- and it's a hard day -- when he realizes he's never going to play professional baseball."

Well, listening to that analysis twice yesterday made it the day in my life -- and it was a hard day -- when I realized I'll never be remotely good at poker.

[5Street83]

Originally Posted by The 6th Wilbury

Not to pimp a non-PR podcast (even though Seebs is okay with it), but Aaron Jones of Leggo Poker does a nice, detailed analysis of this hand on Monday's 2+2 Pokercast. I listened to the segment a couple of times just to soak it all in.

There's a great line in an episode of The West Wing, in which Josh Lyman says, "There comes a day in every man's life -- and it's a hard day -- when he realizes he's never going to play professional baseball."

Well, listening to that analysis twice yesterday made it the day in my life -- and it was a hard day -- when I realized I'll never be remotely good at poker.

Somewhere, Shronk smiles as you quote the West Wing.

[passthesugar]

Originally Posted by DennisG90

BTW, heres another example of Dwan´s sick play, happened yesterday:

http://www.highstakesdb.com/view-han...?GameID=316554

From this hand you can see that this kind of play is bound to go wrong some time given that your opponent has aces/kings or flops a set or just shoves very light.

PS: Hope my text makes any sense, am pretty tired atm

wow!! thats pretty sick!

but to the point that durrr plays too aggro......i dont see it. i think he is smart enough to know when he should tone down his overall aggressiveness. i think that when u play the limits that he does then the swings are gonna be substantial.

not sure what his bankroll is like but i'm sure he may come close to going broke, he's a naturally sick gambler, but im sure ppl will jump at a chance to stake him.

[5carab]

The suggestion in an earlier post that Dwan doesn't know how to play NLH cash against 'great players' is one of the most ridiculous things I have read on these forums. The guy is a freakin' genius, period! Also, he may well be on a sick downswing online, but if you check the straight no limit games he's up. It's PLO that's cost him most of his money, not Hold'Em.

[Jimmy Fricke]

IT'S A FIVE BET.

[DurkaDurkaDurka]

Guys, trying to analyze Durrrr is like trying to understand women. It's a path that will always lead to frustration, pain and suffering.

You should follow my lead and just watch those hands for pure entertainment and enjoyment - a bit like watching 'Deal or no Deal'. When he pulls those funky moves, I giggle like a school girl then I replay it again for a closer look at Howard's reaction.

Trust me, it works.



DDD

[The 6th Wilbury]

Originally Posted by Jimmy Fricke

IT'S A FIVE BET.

hahahahah!

Thanks, Jimmy... I honestly didn't notice that until now. Nine posts in, too. Told you I'll never be a great poker player -- my powers of observation are less than stellar.